I got the story. You talk about digital government and government services, a little bit about you, why you’re in Canada, all that good stuff. I know you’re speaking at a conference. Are you speaking later today, or was it yesterday?

Good. I wanted to make it to the conference, but it didn’t work out. [laughs]

Hopefully.

Perfect. Tell me about why you’re here. Have you met with any Canadian officials or done anything notable?

Yeah. What have you been up to?

How about in Ottawa? What are you up to here?

Canada’s just beginning to get into digital services. In July is when we appointed our minister of digital government. What advice do you have for Canada in terms of how to integrate digital more into everyday life and into government services?

What do you think are some steps that Canada could go about doing that?

Yeah.

I guess that is the biggest thing with Canada. The bureaucracy tends to be pretty slow moving. We’re just starting to move into the more digital space. How do you think that Canada can keep up? Technology moves so quickly that often by the time the government is done procuring something, you think of our pay system which has a giant problem right now.

They procured it 10 years ago and they only launched it in 2016 and already technology has surpassed them. How do you balance that process and bureaucracy with digital technology that’s moving so much faster?

One of the biggest complaints or downsides of automation is that it loses human jobs, because machines can often do things faster than humans can. How do you balance the need for innovation with also making sure people have a way to make money? [laughs]

Transcription is my least favorite part of doing this.

Turning more to you and your work as a minister, why do you choose to have everything transcribed and put on the Internet that you’re...Where does that philosophy come from?

How do you go about your day? What does day look like on maybe an average day when you’re not traveling?

They’re like, "I see in your transcript that you said the government can’t do the solution, so..."

Are you ever concerned about security when you’re traveling around different parts of the world or even different parts of Taiwan? I think of our ministers. A lot of the time, they’re in very structured environments. The Prime Minister’s security guards often say Prime Minister Trudeau was difficult in a way because he loves going into large crowds, which cause security headaches.

Are you ever concerned about stuff with that?

As far as we know, you’re the world’s first transgender minister.

Do you feel like you need to set an example at all or...

No? OK.

Taiwan is a leader in that region on gender issues.

As a minister too, what do you think is the most difficult part of your job?

Yeah.

When you’re thinking of a social policy, you’re also considering impact on the environment and how you can make that more digital, so they all work in tandem.

Would you recommend our digital government minister, for example, do things like the Social Innovation Lab where you sit for 12 hours and just talk to whoever comes in?

Do you use digital technology and Skype into other remote parts? That’s what you mean when you say digital...

You first came to prominence as a protester.

What was that like, to be in the parliament and occupying it?

The digital was the connector between everyone else.

How do you think that can be translated into the Canadian context, where people might not be as familiar with...We’re used to traditional protest in Canada.

How do you go about that to bring about social change?

It’s like releasing any kind of media request, for example, answers.

Are you meeting with any Canadian officials while you’re here?

Which ones?

I think that’s everything. I think I’m out of time. I think I said half an hour?

Perfect. All right, then. You clearly think that technology can make the world better and change the world. What advice would you give to young people who share that dream or that goal?

They take a programming class.

It’s learning how to learn, and unlearn, and re-learn, too.

Because the artificial intelligence can always do better than you.

I want to see if I’ve missed any of my questions here. With social enterprises, how do you get things like non-profits to start thinking more digitally in order to create that ecosystem? A lot of them are underfunded, not funded, or they’re continually in flux. How do you get them to start more digitally and more into the future?

Because government is not cleaning the air.

Government would have to do it.

At a certain point, it does need to come back and recharge.

Are you meeting with Scott Brison at all? I know Canada and Taiwan don’t have diplomatic relations, but I was just wondering, are you planning to meet with him at all or any of his staff?

Carla Qualtrough?

What did you think of their speeches?

Perfect. Is there anything else you’d like to talk about?

I think we’ve talked about everything.

It’s great. I think I am good.